Today on the PRmoment Podcast we’re talking to co-founders of CommsClarity Paul Hender and Richard Bagnal.

These 2 are stalwarts of the PR measurement and evaluation game. They’ve worked together on and off at the likes of Metrica, Cision and Carma for the last over 30 years and today on the show they chat about what is the data opportunity for PR firms.

Fittingly given today's podcast’s theme we’ve just launched our PR Masterclass: The Intersection of Data, Planning and Measurement. Attend this PR Masterclass to hear from experts on the latest techniques, tools and case studies about the use of data in modern communications.

The other big news in public relations is that the PRmoment Awards 2025 are open.

All the categories, the updated entry form and the 2025 entry pack can be viewed on the awards microsite.

Also, thanks so much to the PRmoment Podcast sponsors the PRCA.

3 mins Why is it an interesting and important time for the intersection of data and PR?

“There's a perfect storm of things happening which are contributing to a perfect storm of the need to use data better in PR.”

“There is an increasing cynicism about last click attribution.”

“There is this extraordinary evolution revolution of the the media”

“AI is disrupting the media analysis place.”

“Brands are going to live and die on this.”

“People are taking all these data points and throwing them at the wall and hoping some of the mud sticks.”

8 mins Over the last 10 years many of the legacy media monitoring firms attempted to build something resembling a one stop shop for data. How successful have they tended to be in that strategy?

“What evaluation isn't is templated counting amounts of easy to capture data points.”

14 mins There are so many PR tools now. Indeed many of them are not specific tools to PR. How can PR folks navigate that media monitoring, social listening, audience integration, misinformation and emotion tool market?

Editors note: Golin’s Jonny Bentwood will present his PR Tools Review at PRmoment PR Masterclass in February. (Masterclass 4)

19 mins Has the number of PR tools and media intelligence being bought increased? And is that investment being spent wisely?

20.30 mins How big do agencies tend to be before they bring in either a head of analytics or an analytic team?

“Every agency needs to be able to talk with confidence about data and analytics and the value of its work - and if it can't do that it doesn't have a very bright future.”

22 mins What are PR firms doing with their data? What does good data use by a PR firm look like?

26 mins Should PR firms buy data tools or build them?

30 mins Why the problem of PR people becoming overwhelmed in data is huge.

32 mins PR’s integration of data challenge: How are we doing? With a nod to AMEC’s Integrated Evaluation Framework.

“The whole concept of absolutism has to go out the window. You can’t just chuck out data points. That’s where derision happens.”

37 mins Data storytelling is one of PRs words of the moment. How does that compare with the reality that PR remains in many ways an art form?

40 mins Are many people still using the last click attribution model? The bane of public relations’ budgets for the last 20 years...

42 mins About 10 years ago, there was a lot of chat in the sector that market mix modelling and econometrics might ride to PR’s evaluation rescue. Paul explains to listeners what market mix modelling and econometrics are. And Richard explains why PR and communications people need to start contributing to them.

“It (PR) outperforms. PR can reach more people, in a more creditable way at a lower cost.”

44 mins Finally, the £100K fee per head to work out the fee income of a generalist PR firm has not moved for about 20 years. Paul and Richard explain why better data, analytics and measurement is so important for the future of public relations so that we can drive up investment and agency fees.

“Too many communications professionals are scared. They are not confident that there is value in their work. And that should not be the case.”

If you found the issues discussed in this podcast interesting, do check out the programme for PRmoment’s next PR Masterclass: The Intersection of Data, Planning and Measurement.